I just had my first experience blocking an instance, and it made my realize now nice the lemmy content curation experience is vs the centralized model.
Recently I started noticing a lot of posts from that I just found annoying. There was nothing inherently wrong with them, they just came from a culture I don’t understand and so I found them cringey. Since they all came from one community, realized most of them come from the same instance. I just added that instance to my blocklist and the problem is solved!
Now think about in the centralized model. I would be forced to either just accept that these posts are in my timeline, or block each community and user individually. The instance gave me an easy way to manage my content.
I also appreciate that instances can manage the blocking for their users. So the most horrible stuff I don’t even see. But it also preserves free speech, as those users who want to say horrible things can do so in their own instance, and most people will just block it.
Anyway, just impressed again by the fediverse!
What if OP just blocked feddit.org because they don’t speak German ?
They have that luxury.
The least obvious Hexbear’s user alt:
Actually……
If I were a true hexbear user, I’d be glad to be defederated from lemmy.world. But I’m not.
I think that defederation is a bad idea. That’s why I joined an instance with a relatively hands-off approach to moderation.
You see, I’m an anarchist. I trust in the power of people to self-organize, self-regulate, and self-police. I am philosophically opposed to whole instances making the call to defederate from another no matter how Nazi or capitalist that instance is.
Isn’t someone deciding they don’t like an instance’s content and blocking it themselves exactly what you’re describing?
The irony right?
This is what I love about the fediverse. It is the closest to actual anarchist communities I’ve seen and it works great.
Good point! You’re right. My meme is more to poke fun at the victory lap the user decided to take here to try get a high five for putting on blinders.
A well-executed rebuttal.
What if I told you anyone can run their own server and consequently have the freedom to federate with who they wish?
The value of the Fediverse isn’t just freedom of speech. It’s freedom of association.
I’m a big fan of that option. Did you think I’d be against it? 🤔
Well, you seem to be upset that people are able to block entire instances. That’s just a weird stance for an anarchist to have.
Yeah because it shuts out everyone on that instance.
I’m happy this post isn’t from an instance admin, deciding that their users aren’t allowed to see ANYTHING that originated on an instance that they deem unsavory. I’m just disappointed in OP thinking that shutting all people out from a particular instance regardless of their actions is an act worthy of a victory lap, talking about how great the fediverse is for ignoring people.
Also: Just because I am an anarchist doesn’t mean I have to march in lockstep with what you expect an anarchist to do and say. This is the very crux of my point: that opinions vary wildly and shutting out your ability to even see those opinions is a negative thing for society as a whole.
But it doesn’t. Unless they’ve changed the functionality in the last 3 major revisions or so, a user blocking an instance blocks all posts from that instance. Not the users or their comments on other posts.
It’s an easier way than blocking each community from that instance individually.
On the Fediverse, no admin decides anything a user does. If you don’t like your server, you can just walk over to another one. Most software even makes account migration between servers super easy.
Or if you don’t trust admins at all—and I don’t—you can run your own server and federate with who you please.
This is not Reddit. Admins don’t hold ultimate power of what does or does not get seen. However, you do—and you can mute, block, or defederate as you see fit.
I know all of that, my friend. Not sure how it seemed like I didn’t. namaste
I generally prefer to federate with as many communities as possible, but federating with fascists is a terrible idea. You’re just making people in your community vulnerable to harassment.
People are self organizing onto these instances, and if they don’t like their current one it’s not hard to move. Most people won’t move to one that allows nazis in.
I see nothing wrong with it. But let’s not pretend that it is some badge of honor. We should be ashamed/disappointed that we were forced to censor our feeds rather than finding some better solution to the disgusting Nazi toxicity encroaching on our minds.
I’ve heard the Nazi bar analogy a lot and I can see why people say it. But I have made so much more progress with conservatives when I actually talk to them than when I blindly shut them out. I guess it’s just the tendency of perpetually online anonymous people to get ugly beyond what they would be brazen enough to do without anonymity.
Fascist ideas don’t spread because they make good points. They spread because they get repeated so much. People who don’t know any better believe it because they’ve heard it so many times, or from someone they trust. Federating with fascists gives them more people to spread their ideas to.
Talking to conservatives can definitely help, but it really depends on the context. Just having people who they disagree with in their lives can can be helpful. If you’re someone they trust you might get them to work through some things. Or if you know a topic really well and know what talking points they’re likely to bring up. But it’s nearly impossible to get though to people who already hate you.
Everyone is at a different place with what they want to handle. Some people just want a small friendly community where they have a chance to relax. Others want a more open communities that only keep out the worst. And some are okay with putting up with harassment to reach more people. But generally we shouldn’t force others to put up with that harassment along with us.
That’s great, but it’s not for everyone. What you’re saying here is that when bigots appear, every member of the minorities they target needs to individually block the troll, which they can only do after they’ve been exposed to the bigotry, and which doesn’t help them at all in the future when the troll moves to a new throw away account.
Counter intuitively, what you’re asking for is exactly how you create spaces that actively discourage diversity.
Why not jut have shared block lists that anyone can apsly at their will?
That’s interesting, I assumed so because:
But seems like your opinion actually something consistent and not trolling, in that case I respect your opinion, even if I personally don’t agree with your philosophy I can understand it. It’s good that in the Fediverse you can choose an instance that aligns with your philosophy (Like lemm.ee) and I can choose the one that aligns with mine.
Here’s a big hug for you, intellectually honest fediverse user. 😊
What? what does this even mean, is there an instance dedicated for victims of fascism or something?
That seems like a huge leap. Who knows they might just be blocking an instance that only speaks a language they don’t understand.
No one is entitled to attention, and sometimes people need to take a breather for their own mental health.
So block the communities instead of the ENTIRE INSTANCE.
Smug libs keep shutting out their own neighbors without realizing the disastrous effects of siloing large swaths pf vulnerable people from reaching ANYONE. Tribalism has had such a terrible effect on the world yet I see smug otherwise very intelligent people climbing over one another to engage in it.
IMO, the only way to stop ignorance and hate is to actually know people from MANY walks of life and face those differences head on. If you dismiss every last one of them wholesale at the slightest sign of differences, you are intellectually weak and deserve the dystopian future we are all being herded and astroturfed into.
That’s the same talking points the alt-right uses and we don’t tolerate it.
And I’ve been on the Internet long enough to watch so-called “progressive” spaces get hijacked by the right wing under the guise of “free speech”.
When a culture grows toxic, it’s simply toxic no matter their talking points.
So the fact people have the power to block entire instances at their discretion, this is a good thing.
You are not entitled to my attention, nor am I entitled to yours.
I do not think it’s a good idea to isolate people in cults in their own echo chambers… although my faith in humanity and basic decency has seen better days, I still believe good examples matter.
A user blocking an instance does not block the users from that instance from interacting with the user who blocked.
It’s not well explained, but my understanding is that an instance block just prevents communities from that instance, and posts made by users on thay instance, from showing for the user that blocked the instance. Comments from users of that instance still show for the blocking user, and the block is one way anyway.
Cults aren’t isolated by others. They self-isolate.
Freedom of speech is an “alt-right” talking point?!?!?!
Are you listening to yourself?
To illustrate my point: I heard Elon is against the obvious CIA front organization USAID so I 100% guarantee you’re now pro CIA.
🤣
You have freedom of speech. I also have the freedom to walk away from your speech and listen to someone else.
And that is a wonderful thing. Use the town square analogy and you’ll see that I’m not against THAT. I’m against victory laps advertising the blinders over a whole instance.
People need to know this feature exists and that it’s a good thing.
They’ve literally been banging the freeze-peach button constantly. Every single time there’s consequences for their actions for a decade or two now. Where have you been?
I hear they drink a lot of water too. I think we should give up water to own the nazi’s.
It’s not my concern if you decide to continue self-sabotaging. That’s on you. You’re definitely not helping yourself and not fostering any actual discussion that’s for sure. You must be an Anarchist ironically. Just out for chaos. And not for Mutual Aid and understanding.
Insult me all you want. You didn’t change my mind.
Ps. Look at the rest of the discussions I am having with people. It seems the tone of this particular thread in the conversation is destined for toxicity because you’re not ready to admit the ugly truth about your perspective.
This! I hate that LW defederates from Hex, and Beehaw and any others. LW needs to update the Lemmy version and federate with all.
Open debate is critical for ethics and intelligence. I wish we were much more capable of open minded debate here. I would totally play the role of high-Mach devils-advocate to get people talking about controversial and high tension subjects while being abstracted and attempting not to offend as best I can while playing the role of the bad guy. I’m afraid users here are totally incapable of this level of engagement depth. The concept of a safe place to take such a controversial position of true free speech seems beyond the capability of most here. Like a transgender person should have the opportunity to debate their politization issues from both sides. Or like, I hate what has happened in Gaza, but I also hate a culture that coexists with honor killing without absolutely reforming purging the practice with distain. I should be able to argue as a devils advocate from many angles even when I find them repugnant. I am very good at this kind of debating. I have my own issues with my life situation where I would need people to understand the scope of such a community and participating users. It is a difficult balance to argue hated positions and others understand that those positions and ideas are not your own. When such debates are had, it leads to a much deeper understanding of issues within a community as a whole.
The high school I went to was in a very poor all black community and was designed to uplift the best and brightest of that community while drawing in similar students from the surrounding region to make up around 20% of students. There were some very racist views and tensions at times mostly from black students towards white. The Wednesday seminar/debate classes from start of the day until lunch were the ultimate solution. We debated politics, religion, racism, rape, authoritarianism, communism, anarchism, and a bunch of other stuff. It got super heated at times. When no one wanted to take the negative interlocutor perspective, the teacher would try but I quickly learned I saw the situation more clearly than them and was good at being the bad guy (or the good guy). By arguing the opposing perspective it reveals much about what one believes and how to argue it effectively.
I have an entire framework for such a community saved in rough drafted notes on my phone that I made weeks ago but I don’t think Lemmy is capable of this in practice.
Folks like you and the hundred other people also “just asking questions” or playing devils advocate" and expecting trans people to engage in a debate as to whether or not we actually deserve equal rights is exactly why this shit never works.
It’s interesting to you because it’s purely intellectual. To the person having to endlessly argue that they do in fact deserve equal rights, it’s a shit fucking experience that we actively seek to disengage from when possible, because it’s all around us, all the time.
Beehaw defederated from LW, not the other way around IIRC
Yeah but it was because of issues on LW that went unresolved. It is very likely that the problem individuals are not even on LW any more. Plus the user tools have changed. Reaching out to mend the bridge should be a top priority for the top instance as should unbanning any and all possible. Such behaviour is the only respectable way to stay at the top and grow Lemmy. If bridges can’t be mended, at least document that the effort was made so users of both instances are aware.
Thank you so much!!!
I couldn’t have said it any better. ✊🏽