No, sorry, only one thing can be true at once. My working memory is really small.
Hell, the socialist aesthetics aren’t even necessary. Just hating the United States is enough.
USA <- old and busted
FSA <- new and even more busted because the F is for Fascist.
Aesthetics is doing some heavy lifting in that statement.
Nuance is hard, yo…
Nah, think I’m going to boil down hundreds of years of history in to 280 characters, that’s the best way to get my point across in the tiktok age.
Sure why engage with the actual reasons that leftists express for (varying levels of critical) support for any given country when you can ignore all that and dunk on this vague and convenient strawman.
Would you like me to drag out quotes of the exact kind of fucking insanity I’m talking about, or will you dismiss those as made-up strawmen that I conveniently planted over dozens of accounts with thousands of upvotes over a space of years and across multiple platforms?
It kinda doesn’t matter what you call China, mixed economies outperform market economies.
Every major fucking country on earth today is a mixed economy.
Fair point, probably not the best term to use. In the video, Clinton uses “command economy” to describe them, and singles them out as member of the WTO that isn’t a market economy.
China hasn’t been a command economy since the 80s, though. And command economies consistently underperform market economies, to a staggering degree.
I mean, they’re everyone’s largest trading partner. You’d expect a planned economy to under perform the evolutionary pressures of a market. The first time. But the second? Or the third? What about command economy that learns from what didn’t work in the past?
If every country is a mixed economy, then they’re just the far end of the spectrum. More command than market, at least compared to most other places.
I mean, they’re everyone’s largest trading partner.
They’re also the largest country, by population, in the world.
You’d expect a planned economy to under perform the evolutionary pressures of a market. The first time. But the second? Or the third? What about command economy that learns from what didn’t work in the past?
Uh, but planned economies do underperform compared to a market. The spike in Chinese prosperity was because of intense market reforms in the 80s and 90s which significantly increased prosperity and turned the country from immensely backwards and impoverished to increasingly developed.
If every country is a mixed economy, then they’re just the far end of the spectrum. More command than market, at least compared to most other places.
Not really. The Chinese public sector of their economy is actually lower, as a proportion of GDP, than Sweden.
I’m curious about the source of this statement
The Chinese public sector of their economy is actually lower, as a proportion of GDP, than Sweden
Can you provide source? Because for State Owned Enterprises I can only find metric ~40% (China) vs 10% in Sweden.
https://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/exp@FPP/USA/JPN/GBR/SWE/ITA/ZAF/IND/CHL/FRA/GRC/NLD/ESP/RUS
China’s private sector has become much larger than in years past - from ~2% of the economy in the 1980s, to ~20% in the late 1990s, to a majority now (though there’s some quibbling as to the exact numbers).
Hamas are terrorists, they killed civilians on 7th October
… okay?
Your meme kind of works for hamas/Isreal too.
Yes hamas is bad
But it doesn’t mean Isreal should murder civilians
Or the other way around
Yes Isreal is bad
But it doesn’t mean hamas should be murdering civilians
oops sorry mistook you for one of those “Israel bad Hamas good”-guys
Never heard of people saying Hamas good.
oh you must be new to lemmy then or maybe have a healthier online life
Option 2 most likely. But lemmy is already a healthier social media choice.
Wrong comm, both Israel and Hamas is evil, we know.
I am more pissed at people who don’t know difference between Hamas and Palestine. “Hamas is bad, lets fight palestine. And Syria too. Go for Uzbekistan while at it. I heard Albania is a muslim country too. Indonesia…”
Issue is Hamas are the government of Gaza, and it’s pretty hard to get past that.
Plus the same people can’t tell the difference between Israel and Jews in general so maybe it’s just a lack of comprehension and reasoning.
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I’d still rather have a state that pretends to be socialist than one that upholds capitalism - an ideology that seeks to place everything and everyone under the domination of a few elites.
“Golly gee, I sure do love this state which pretends to be socialist, but upholds capitalism by placing everything and everyone under the domination of a few elites!”
How is that worse than what we currently have?
Are you… legitimately asking how Western democracies like Canada and Germany are better than the kind of systems that the PRC and USSR ran?
Things can be bad without being equally bad.
Venmo me $10
that use the aesthetics of socialism
This isn’t even a criteria for many
Can anyone explain what the aesthetics of socialism are and which atrocities are being hidden?
Could it be China? But they aren’t Socialist.
Not in practice, but they do claim to be (and in fairness, do some things in a more “socialist” way - looking at you privatisation in the west…)
I think this what OOP means with “aesthetics”, it’s that they claim to be a socialist state, when in many ways, it’s rather capitalist.
Regardless, holding up any country as a beacon of all that is good is pretty silly, if you ask me.
No where (that I know of) should be emulated in every regard.
I think Xi self identifies as Marxist Leninist
Could it be China? But they aren’t Socialist.
Take that up with tankies, who will argue long and passionately that China is actually very socialist.
Don’t worry - this is tankiejerk. We’re an anti-tankie comm. Bootlickers aren’t tolerated here.
That’s why they keep repeating the phrase “critical support”. They support oppressive regimes in their fight against the US, but still remain critical of them (any criticism of their favorite dictatorship will get you banned).
It’s actually more like “critical hit” in a video game. If they hit a critical support with their internet comment then North Korea gets +5 anti imperialism for 20 minutes. It’s the meta bro
“Whataboutism” is one of the most prevalent logical fallacies. It never makes any sense.
If the much worse enemies of the USA have a lot to gain by the USA’s downfall and are actively promoting said downfall, then it’s not whataboutism to unmask them like a scooby doo villain.
Tankies don’t give af about trans rights, Tankies don’t give af about any human rights, Tankies don’t want you to live and flourish in any capacity at all. Do not be fooled by their rhetoric all over Lemmy.
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It’s literally a crime to portray LGBT in Chinese media, they’ve been censoring it harder than ever recently.
Don’t even get me started on Russia or Iran.
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It’s mostly from .ml in my experience, Hell, look at the goons spouting off against tgis post in these very comments. .ml
IMO, self respecting instances need to defederate from .ml so they are not so overrun by tankie clapping sealions… Just like with hexbear, they deserve to be silenced by social forces.
Another top contender is that all things with defects or drawbacks are equally horrible and unacceptable.
The infallabile “ha, gotcha” fallacy
But… dichotomy is best omy? Putin can’t be lying, because other states bad.
Also, if we want to make progress in the world and not let billionaires play us against each other, maybe the best judgement process is to evaluate how things are working out overall instead of slapping a black hat on anything that isn’t perfect enough for a white hat.
