The site provides a nice TL,DR:
- Efforts like Graphene OS face increasing pressure from apps that refuse to run on non-standard Android.
- The custom ROM project characterizes Google’s approach to device attestation as incomplete and flawed.
- Graphene OS is prepared to take legal action if Google won’t let it pass Play Integrity checks.
Thanks
The whole idea of device attestation is flawed. Majority of apps shouldn’t be dealing with it at all, but minding their own business.
The hero we don’t deserve
On a personal note, I’m annoyed that our national ID app doesn’t work with graphene OS.
There are workarounds by patching out the security check from the app and sideloading the newly created app, but that is just annoying and has to be repeated for every update.
I just don’t see how rigorose device checks that lock out graphene users, but allow any Android 8.0+ device (where security support ended more than 3 years ago) make ANY sense.
Edit: I tried it again today, it now lets me skip with a warning about the bootloader.
It isn’t a security feature, more like a backdoor checkbox.
Or frontdoor checkbox for that matter, given that it’s the literal device owner that takes the action tripping their “security” tripwire.
It only makes sense when you look at it from the perspective of a greedy corporation with a fake “open source” ideology.
What national ID is it? I hope it isn’t the Belgian ItsMe app because I want to try putting lineage on my xperia 5 ii since it has a flaky fingerprint scanner now (software problem it seems)
ID Austria
“National ID app” sounds like something from 1984. I personally would never agree to something like that.
I understand that even the concept is scary to some, especially to our friends on the other side of the atlantic.
However, it isn’t really anything else than a 2FA app, similar to most banking apps. When you interact with a government service (like taxes, social security), you have to approve the login on your phone.
Is it libre? Can I opt out and use physical ID? If the answer is no to any of those you shouldn’t use it.
The app is not Libre, sadly. But it is possible to use a yubikey instead, then you need noting else than a web browser.
Using physical ID is possible, but this would mean that I would need to walk to some office.
It’s high time Custom ROMs and users alike did this. I cannot run a custom ROM on my primary device due to play integrity shenanigans some apps may have.
Looking forward to this. I don’t run a custom ROM myself but I am rooted, primarily to revoke permissions from Google apps and to back up my OS and app data as I desire.
However I’d much prefer to be able to run something like GrapheneOS on a Pixel if it meant I could run apps that are picky about Safetynet/Play Integrity, such as banking apps and the like
CalyxOS lets me run most safety net stuff, though notably Pokemon go stopped working all of a sudden.
CalyxOS lets me run most safety net stuff…
SafetyNet is deprecated.
https://developer.android.com/privacy-and-security/safetynet/deprecation-timeline
Most things works fine, if they don’t there are ways around it, like installing the neutered play version. Only hard NO currently is Gpay.
Not missing root functionality things at all
Not gonna like. This is interesting. Who knew that messing with the ROM community could put Google in trouble.
“Trouble”
I think they will be fine as they have a huge market share in Android
I think you’d be surprised. CalyxOS are making massive claims. If the US or the EU investigate, Google could be fined or worse.
Seems at least plausible, given the whole “gatekeeper” regulations (EU).
Device attestation is pretty annoying fr. It’s a constant game of cat and mouse to get it to work on a Custom ROM, whether its on the devs of the ROM, or whoever maintains the magisk modules if you’re rooted. I do hope things change about this
Wow, I never thought I’d agree with the devs of GrapheneOS on something
Honestly Lineage OS deserves some love. It can serve as both a daily driver and as a base for other systems. It could even been used by companies.
I know, I’ve been using it since 2010, when it was still called CyanogenMod :)
It would be interesting to see if Graphene OS actually takes legal action. I hope if they do they get other projects involved including Lineage OS and maybe F-droid.
According to Graphene OS, the Compatibility Test Suite and Compatibility Definition Document requirements Google says are key to Play Integrity compliance are in practice routinely ignored, and the system easily bypassed.
Just wanted to say, I use a custom ROM with software on it to circumvent the Play integrity stuff.
Oh no, my device is insecure, there could be malware on it. But people use Windows PCs to access their banking website. I’m sure there can’t be any malware on PCs!
I would love to hear about this bypass. My old routes don’t work no more
Basically Magisk with Zygisk and this module
https://xdaforums.com/t/module-play-integrity-fix-safetynet-fix.4607985/
Ah damn. Still possible, but not as straight forward as before.
Out of curiosity, have you ever had an update break your bypass?
Most of the time you gotta install the bypass/Magisk again after update, so yes, basically every update.
I rooted my phone years ago and it was a chore. Once it finally worked, hardly any of my apps would run and nothing important worked because suddenly a rooted phone isn’t “safe”. It was such a pain in the ass to do updates and fight programs to run that I stopped. I didn’t want to spend hours fixing a device that I really didn’t want to think about.
I would love to install GrapheneOS and have it mostly just work. I hate having my phone locked down like it’s not mine, and it’s one of the reasons I won’t use it for anything important over my desktop.
You don’t need Graphene OS (I had a different post about this)
Any custom ROM without Google and with F-droid apps will be much better.
Well, right, it doesn’t have to be a specific OS. I haven’t done much research because I’m my current situation, it’s not a good option for me as (for instance) some of my required 2FA apps won’t validate on a rooted phone.
If that changes, I’d do more research, obviously.
Why would you need root?
Does anyone have experience with Fairphone? Im gonna buy new phone and need recommendation
It’s hard not to feel a tiny bit of schadenfreude, given this project has shilled extremely hard for Google from day one. I will wait to see if the threats of legal action actually amount to anything. GrapheneOS has a history of putting out very aggressive and threatening public statements and never actually backing them up with action. How much of that was down to the founder being a completely unhinged individual is yet to be seen.
